Curse

Scott42 · Apr 26, 2006, 12:48 PM // 12:48

From what I can tell by all the changes made every effort has been made to stop aggressive farming particularly bots.

But why is it that if you play the game solo, the items dropped are far better than if you work in a team and kill the same creatures, does that not encourage farming? Would it not be better to increase drops for full party’s and maybe even better for balanced party’s using diverse range of heroes? Then you would just have full party’s farming all the time, is this bad?

If you try to form a team to go play in Underworld you’re stuck with the choice of let me see I need a Trapper ranger or a Invincible monk to go down with a Spiteful Spirit Necromancer or even a Barage Ranger. If you suggest going to Underworld with a full party your laughed at because you receive very little for your efforts. But if I go down in a pair kill everything this way I actually pick up good items and get what you would expect for a such an elite area is this fair?

Am I alone in these thoughts?

Arkantos · Apr 26, 2006, 01:18 PM // 13:18

When your in a team you have a 1 in x chance of getting a rare item because your with other players. When you solo farm you dont always get a rare, and when your with a team you dont always get a rare. People laugh when you get a group for UW because to them the only good way to do it is 55ing. Chances are if you can be a 55 monk/SS SV necro you wont go to UW with a full group.

R A C · Apr 26, 2006, 01:21 PM // 13:21

I agree. Although people could just bring a full, balanced group of henchies down with them and then just farm like normal. That is, if it was like you wanted and the drops per person were better in such a group than solo. Wouldn't solve anything I don't think.

Miakoda · Apr 26, 2006, 01:21 PM // 13:21

Good point and I agree with the sentiment, it would make the usual "hunt" pugs much more willing to form varied parties in outposts and not worry about "must have" classes. No one feels unwanted.

Maybe even strategy will come into it rather than the "ideal" group mentality that steamrolls it's way through a zone to get to the end of it in the fastest and most effecient farming methos possible. If the loot is the same for groups as it is for solo.. Or if solo loot is reduced farther making it the same as if you were in a group or henchie team then maybe that sense of community may start to arise.

Evilsod · Apr 26, 2006, 01:36 PM // 13:36

They really need to improve drops for bigger teams to actually make it appealing. I can go in a full B/P team to FoW and get 1 shard in 3 hours (like my last trip) or go as a solo farmer and get at least 1 shard in 30minutes of forest clearing. In other drops i made about the same in gold/items as the Forest farming trip as i did on a the almost full clearance trip.

Undivine · Apr 26, 2006, 02:38 PM // 14:38

You are not alone in your sentiments, but this thread is asking for trouble. The farmers are very passionate about being able to do their farming. You will be flamed.

CKaz · Apr 26, 2006, 02:59 PM // 14:59

I totally agree and always thought this.

* There should be an xp bonus for groups
Otherwise you'll always look to do the maximum with the minimum amount of players for XP grind - levels, skill points, etc Wouldn't have to be big but when I need some skillpts it's off to solo with a scroll. This isn't as big of a deal though as quests can counter/beat that, where applicable.

** There should be a drop bonus for groups **
This is much much bigger and really th reason people get solo oriented. Drops really bite and it's been theorized they even become less available as you play your character more - fun hmm? :b In a group of 8 you're lucky if you see anything nice all night, fill up your pack with any worthwhile sell items... heck even fill up your pack

I don't think a few more drops would send the world out of whack and might help fight over-reliance on cheese play (ie 'kegging'), fotms and slimming the #s as much as possible.

Simply adding a little more dropping as the party #s increase, what's the big deal IMO?

[Sounds like they're killing the item-holding aggro but the point still stands.]

Many other MMORPGs implement one, the other, or both of these.
Soloing will always be viable, I'd just ask a little more love on a sliding scale for groups.

Parn · Apr 26, 2006, 03:01 PM // 15:01

Actually the guild I'm in goes to UW frequently and Ectos drop a bunch more when you have a full group....but none for any of the monks doing all the work. On top of the monks getting nothing the monsters aggro monks from a mile away past your tank to run you down..ect. mindblade spectres (chaos planes) last group of eight we took down there 11 ectos dropped. Not a single one for the 2 monks.

aelyn · Apr 26, 2006, 03:21 PM // 15:21

I completely agree with this idea. Nobody wants to farm solo for hours just so that they can get the cash to their FoW armor. And that's not the point of this game anyways, the point is to play with your friends and enjoy it. It would be great to be able to wander with your friends and get the same amount of rares and gold that I can get from soloing the FoW forest...

Furthermore, if someone really didn't like people (i hope i dont get flames from hermits, but i guess they wouldn't be found on forum now, would they?

), they could always go with henchies or by themselves and enjoy the current levels of drops for soloing (for a challenge).

Wouldn't it be great to be rewarded for being on a good team that works together efficiently? Even fellow farmers (believe me, I farm too) would have to agree that if we could get the same stuff by working as a team with our friends we'd all be much happier with it.

/signed and a half

Hunter Sharparrow · Apr 26, 2006, 04:19 PM // 16:19

Absolutely. Something has to be done. I made a suggestion on these forum that the drop rate should be 1 in x (x being the max party size in that region) no matter what your actual party sized is. This is so that it's no more rewarding for the solo farmer as it is for the full size group. Of course instant flame from the many people on here that are passionate about farming as Undivine said. Another suggestion would be that something always drops for you regardless of the party size. So if your in a full group of 8 then when you kill an enemy it drop 8 items at random with one assigned to each player. This way if gold drops it doesn't have to be shared amongst the team and can be assigned to a particular person. Why should those that repetitively be rewarded more than those that play the game doing the missions and quests. This would certainly make bots and sweatshop farmers not worth the time since they would lose the ebay buiseness. Also if you want to farm go right ahead or if you don't and only want to do the quests and missions in full parties then go right ahead. You will get equally rewarded either way.

Evilsod · Apr 26, 2006, 04:31 PM // 16:31

I'm not saying drops should be identical whether you solo farm or go for full groups. If you can successfully solo farm areas you deserve your reward.
It would just be nice if they improved drops a bit for bigger teams. Not to the same level as if you went in solo, just improved.

I have absolutely no reason to go in to FoW with full balanced teams anymore, Barrage/Pet teams all the way. Much faster so at least if you do get jack shit you get jack shit faster and can go again. Then of course after a couple of runs with immensely shitty drops for B/P its back to solo farming the forest for a bit.

It just doesn't seem right that in 30 minutes you can fill your inventory with crap while solo farming and it then takes you 3hours to do the same in a full team. The only bonus is with FoW where you can run around afterwards and sell it all to the Forgemaster, doing that normally doubles your take.

TheMosesPHD · Apr 26, 2006, 05:57 PM // 17:57

I think I get the best drops when I go in teams of 2 or 3. My drops aren't really that great when I solo. At first they are, but as soon as I've been farming something for a lil while the drops go down to being just decent. When I go in large groups, I don't really have much of a chance to get drops anyway, especially when I'm playing the monk, but when I say, do a Spider run with my warrior along with a couple guildies, my drops are great.

Speaking of guilds, I personally also think you get better drops if you go in groups with your guild, or the majority of the group is all from one guild. Don't take my word on that though, I can't be sure.

actionjack · Apr 26, 2006, 06:00 PM // 18:00

I think should split between solo and farming.

Farming is encouraged.. because that is pretty much what dev made for the End-Game content. (since they don't want people to live, as it would look bad for a online game, thus they make FoW armor and farming area as a lure to keep people stay in)

Unless there is a secret conspircy theory that the Dev make certain area easily soloable for the pro-farmers, I don't think it is really encourage. For most part, the high level area are hard to solo, and require a full group of differnt prof to survie. However, people are able to find certain ways to exploit differnt part of the map, and manage to solo it. Its both a bad game deisng and ingenious player.

The Mobs need to change more, so you don't always see the same type of mob at same location all the time.

quickmonty · Apr 26, 2006, 06:26 PM // 18:26

All the newer players that were looking forward to farming and making money just got screwed big time by the latest update. "Book/keg/gear trick" doesn't work anymore. Ettins in NKP aren't even dropping ettin crap anymore. (Although the fire imps are dropping loads of charcoal) Going to check to see what else has been nerfed.

Glad I got my fortune already

Hildi · Apr 26, 2006, 06:38 PM // 18:38

I enjoy solo farming, I actually got bored of the PvE aspect of this game, till lately when I made a 55 necro. I don't farm for uber weapons or gold (even though they are nice) I do it more to test my own skills. I wouldn't mind if they fixed the drops for the larger groups, but to take away good drops from ppl just b/c they have the skill to kill things by themselves isn't right.

They've moved the bird creatures to the head of the cave in Mineral Springs where the IDS drop, so no more easy soloing.

madman420 · Apr 26, 2006, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hildi

They've moved the bird creatures to the head of the cave in Mineral Springs where the IDS drop, so no more easy soloing.

That has been happening for a while now. It's just a bad spawn, doesn't happen all the time.

Hildi · Apr 26, 2006, 07:06 PM // 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by madman420

That has been happening for a while now. It's just a bad spawn, doesn't happen all the time.

Good, I just started enjoying that run again.

Scott42 · Apr 26, 2006, 07:47 PM // 19:47

I am glad people understand where I’m coming from. I read someone say that farmers would then just take henchman and farm all the same, that’s probably very true but at least then when people do go as a team they do get rewarded for there efforts. I hear what Hildi is saying about farmers and I agree for people to be able to farm solo is clever and should be rewarded but as it stands those people get 8x the reward a member in a party gets. Also in my experience it seems like the quality of the items dropped does seem to be less.

I love my PvE and I’m in a small guild of very good friends that all help each other out and we follow story line read quests talk skills amongst ourselves and its been a strong guild from nearly the day the game opened. But because I’m now such a seasoned player I decided I would like to get FoW armour for my key character I get a bit of cash helping people and working in teams etc. and I have been working towards my FoW for nearly 3 months and I have made little headway in the required materials. Then I meet this new guy he has all four of his hero’s kitted out with FoW armour and has enough in his inventory waiting for the new Factions hero’s and he has been playing for the same time as me. I ask him how he has done this and he just says soloing UW or FoW and here’s me foolishly getting my guild friends all together so we can go to FoW or UW and battling the forces of evil together to get materials for our nice shiny new armour.

I think after reading what everyone has had to say it should be made that the amount of loot received by the individual should be no different if your solo, in a party of 2-3 or max size of 8 this wouldn’t stop farming by no means because it is the same if they go in a party of 8. But as it stands there is no appeal for me to go with my friends so I have now made a farming build with a friend so we can go as a pair and yes it does work great, but I want to play the game with my good friends not have to say sorry we cant have more than 2 or ill never get there, I don’t need you but they want the armour too can they not join me? No they cant, they have to solo.

Matsumi · Apr 26, 2006, 08:26 PM // 20:26

I agree. I always thought it was a bit strange that a person in a group of 8 gets maybe 10-20 gold per drop, it's hard enough as it is to make money in this game. The drops should be more evenly distributed among all the party members as well.

I also like to solo farm too, so I don't think that would make it less rewarding for me. Like somebody said recently, it's also a good place to test your skills. So, even if you do decide to go solo, I don't think it should be discouraged so much.

M3lk0r · Apr 26, 2006, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Very nicely said Scott42.

It would be nice if solo farming was actualy "hard", as it stands, a typical wammo or 55 build doesnt even need the fraction of "skill" a decent boon prot in a balanced team would need.